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Growing up, Carolyn Lam had no interest in being a lawyer. Her parents, immigrants from Vietnam, were against her becoming an attorney. “They were extremely concerned about my decision to become a lawyer, and what they saw on TV wasn’t promising,” Lam said. “Who wants your kid to learn how to weasel their way out of the truth and subvert the law?”
Lam did fine. Better than fine, actually. She is now the deputy GC at Dallas-based Ecobat, the world’s largest battery recycler. And her successes during the past year and a half include settling a major class action lawsuit against Ecobat for pennies on the dollar, the divestiture of seven different business operations across three countries in southern Africa and the implementation of the company’s first global anticompetition training program and global code of conduct.
The Lawbook visited with the 2023 DFW Corporate Counsel Award finalist about her best day at Ecobat, the biggest challenges facing legal departments for accomplishing DEI objectives and what outside counsel needs to know about her.
Texas Lawbook: What has been your best day working at Ecobat?
Carolyn Lam: It’s so cheesy and it’s said so often, but virtually every day is my best day. Even on the hardest days, our small and mighty legal team exemplifies joy in service and leadership. Each of us have developed networks within other departments that are based upon a foundation of trust that we’re all here to accomplish the business’s goals with the most integrity and efficiency possible. This comes from the top down – our C-suite creates a safe environment to bring new ideas to the table, creatively problem solve and embrace our collective entrepreneurial spirit. I can’t imagine a better place for people to do their best work.
Lawbook: What are the biggest challenges facing corporate legal departments and law firms for accomplishing DEI objectives in today’s legal and political environments?
Lam: Implicit bias and laziness. Firing someone for using a racial epithet is simple. It’s less easy to explain why the person who’s done the job before may not always be the best candidate to someone who “just wants to hire the best person for the job.” Presenting law firm statistics on lack of big firm diversity and poor promotion rates of diverse associates is also easy.
And then came Students For Fair Admissions, [which encouraged those] who actively work against corporate initiatives on diversity, equity, inclusion and accessibility programs that seek to ensure employees from all backgrounds have equal opportunities.
It’s becoming more difficult each day. Disheartening. What lifts me up is the promise of progress. While the European Union’s new Corporate Sustainability Reporting Directive isn’t without its challenges, I take comfort in the fact that … change is coming. Mandatory disclosures on access to equal opportunities, working conditions and civil rights will soon be the norm. You can bet that I’ll be considering our law firms when it comes to our service supply chain disclosures!
Lawbook: What are the factors you consider when deciding about hiring outside counsel?
Lam: I need lawyers who understand our business, and I don’t mean the dismantling of batteries and melting of metal to create ingots. When I hire a lawyer to do an investigation, I don’t just want to know if a vendor bribed a plant manager, I want to know whether that plant’s leaders respected the integrity of the investigation? Did you know how to create an environment where employees feel safe in an interview? What other impediments to honesty exist? If there’s any merit to the allegations, why wasn’t this reported before? What architectural failures occurred to even allow for this occurrence? Why weren’t there fail safes in place?
Similarly, I need lawyers who can do more than present me with black letter law. How does the way that we negotiate this contract align with our company’s long-term strategic plans? How can we structure contractual obligations to protect the integrity of our supply chain? How can we maintain flexibility when negotiating with a monopolistic supplier?
And of course, every in-house counsel’s favorite question, “How much cost certainty can you give me?”
Lawbook: What does outside counsel need to know about you?
Lam: Your ability to relate to my clients without going native matters to me more than your resume. I’m more impressed by lawyers who love the practice of law than lawyers who bill 3,000 hours a year. I really do love my clients, even when I’m rolling my eyes. I feel terrible when I ask you for a response before end of day, but today means TODAY. I know how to Google, too.
Lawbook: Who are your heroes in life?
Lam: My parents. My generation is the first in our family to have not personally witnessed life-threatening violence inflicted upon a family member. From French colonialism to Japanese occupation to two rounds of war and then communist reeducation, I marvel that my parents still had the capacity to dream of a better life. And more than dream, they joined other refugees on an overpacked motorboat, nearly capsizing, until they housed like cattle at Thailand’s Songkhla Camp. They spent more than a year there, relying on charity to survive with my mother’s two teenage brothers, until they could move to Missouri, where they didn’t just see snow for the first time, they endured a record-breaking blizzard while pregnant — with me.
So when my father says that he feels gratitude every time his car starts and my 68 year old mother’s eyes light up at the idea of negotiating with a Marrakech street hawker, I am awed. My parents’ strength is drawn from more than the primal urge to survive, but to live lives rich in spirit and experience. They are at once content and thankful for what they have, but also intensely aware that complacency is never the answer.
Things to consider at the family holiday parties, where they ask, for the twelfth time, if I’m eating my vegetables, going to sleep at a decent hour and saving for a rainy day.
Click here for the full profile of Carolyn Lam.